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Re: Distribution problem
On Mon, 7 Dec 1992, John Cowan wrote:
John answers me:
> > 2) The point about selgadri, though correct, is irrelevant. The reason you
> > cannot expand a connection inside a selgadri to connected sumti is nothing
> > to do with jeks: it applies just as much with giheks:
> > lo nixli gi'a nanla cu broda (1)
> This sentence is not good Lojban. Lojban does not allow giheks (external
> connections) within description selbri. In fact, giheks don't connect
> selbri at all -- they connect whole bridi-tails.
Good point. You are quite right.
> > 3) My formal semantic account of kazytanru is slightly flawed, because it
> > is clear to me that the semantic domain of a tanru is not strictly a
> > restriction of that of the tertanru (got it right this time!)
> > Thus I am clear that
> > labno prenu
> > is a reasonable tanru for 'werwolf' (also prenu labno), even though I deny
> > that
> > lo labno prenu cu prenu
> Why? You think werewolves don't have personality? Remember prenu != remna.
You're right, I had forgotten that.
> > I think there may well be a case for explicitly distributive jeks - as
> > somebody (Iain?) said, a sort of abbreviation
> > cmalu ckule gi'e melbi ckule
> > (This is one interpretation of "cmalu je melbi ckule"). However, I'm
> > dubious, because again, the semantics of the kazytanru in the two cases
> > need not be the same).
> Rightly or wrongly, JCB invented jeks (known to him as sheks) for this
> very purpose. If we are to overthrow his interpretation, we need to
> be aware what we are doing and why.
JCB also had, (in the edition of L1 that I have - 3rd?) a number of
meanings of "Pretty Little Girls School" with 'crossed' scopes - the
equivalent of eg
cmalu nixli ckule gi'e melbi ke nixli ckule
somehow contracted in this sort of way. As I recall, he eventually
disowned these (though I may be wrong - are they in the recent edition?).
I suggest that they are just the same kind of thing - trying for a formal
structure because it looks neat, without thinking about whether there is a
reasonable semantic structure to correspond to it.
> > (NB everybody - the last ["labno joi prenu"] is not a tanru! Word
> > encompassing them all please?),
> I think "tanru" can handle them all. One can specify various types of
As "tanru" is currently defined, I don't think it can - though, once
again, tanru based on zo tanru certainly could be made to.